Ran across this interesting piece this morning promoting Al-Anon as an alternative to divorce for people married to alcoholics.
Is this news? Not really, but I tell you about it for two reasons: first, because I admire and respect the wonderful work Al-Anon does; second, because my anecdotal experience offers reason for caution. Let’s take them in order.
Al-Anon is a 12-step program just like Alcoholics Anonymous. Here’s what the article says about the strength of Al-Anon for family members of alcoholics: “[T]he people you will find in the Al-Anon meeting rooms understand, as perhaps few others can, exactly how you feel. They have been there too, but they have discovered that they can find contentment and even happiness, whether the alcohoic is still drinking or not.”
Al-Anon recommends that you attend at least six meetings before you decide whether Al-Anon is approprate for you. As the group says, “There are no dues and fees in Al-Anon and, as an old saying goes, -If after six meetings you decide that Al-Anon is not for you, we will gladly refund your misery.'”
Now the caution. Al-Anon really isn’t focused on stopping your spouse from drinking. It’s more about achieving happiness independent of the behavior of others. And that’s probably the right focus. At least in my anecdotal experience, getting your alcoholic spouse to leave the bottle alone is no panacea for your marriage. In fact, if anything, it’s the opposite.
I am intrigued at the number of divorces I see occurring soon after one of the spouses has stopped drinking. One of the spouses has been hanging on and putting up with that alcoholic for years. Finally, their husband or wife, for whatever reason, stops. Dry. Hallelujah, right? A new chance for this troubled marriage, right?
Maybe so, but a lot of them come see me, and it’s usually the non-drinking spouse who is the leaver. How come? Here are my guesses:
1. Now the non-drinking spouse knows the (formerly) drinking spouse will be able to make it, so there’s not quite so much guilt attached to leaving.
2. In their former drinking days, the non-drinking spouse could blame all things wrong on the drinking. And in a curious way, there was always hope that things would get better if the drinking stopped. Now the drinking has stopped, there’s little or no relationship, and now there’s no hope.
3. I don’t understand as much as I need to about co-dependency, but there’s no question that it’s real. Sometimes the non-drinking spouse in a twisted way needs the drinking spouse to keep hitting the bottle. There’s an emptiness that settles in when the drinking spouse stops, because the main role of the non-drinking spouse had been to manage his or her spouse’s drinking. Now what?
Does all this mean that if you’re an alcoholic or married to one that you should do nothing about it? Of course not. However, it may mean you address the problem with a little different perspective about what it might mean if you’re able to stop the drinking.
Your thoughts?
Doug,
Congratulations, I can’t imagine how hard it was to actually do that. Even though I know that it is the right thing to do, I am still with my alcoholic husband. I haven’t had a chance to go to Al Anon- but that is part of my plans after the holiday season.
I was wondering, did you have a eureka moment, when you finaly knew that you had to leave your wife? How did you do it?
Thanks
Ann
I have just read all the comments on this site and find it helpful to see I`m not the only one going through this hell. I have been married to my wife for 23 years, and when we married what I didnt realize was my wife had a drinking problem since age 14 (I have recently found out). Through the years she had been in treatment 3 times, a Dui and has given lots of verbal and physical abuse.At one point she left me and the children because she just couldn’t handle the stress? anymore but I know she was with her boyfriend. She came back univited because I guess she couldn;t financially make it. Her boyfriend took it upon himself to call me repeatedly and tell me how he had sex with her 42 times and describe her body in great detail. I guess he was afraid of losing her. After he saw that she wasn’t coming back to him he threatend to kill our family. Last time in treatment she was in I/Outpatient for over a year and when finished she basically said she has given up and will never go back and will drink until it kills her. Being good to her word (one of the few times) she has drank every day since for 8 months. She has threatend to kill herself although i can’t see that she has tried, and said she would like to kill me. Every evening she is drunk and gets emotional and angry and goes on and on in circles forgetting what she has said sometime keeping me up til 3 in the morning not letting me sleep although I have to go to work in the morning to support the family. I was raised not believing in divorice althought I am fast becoming a believer in it. I have teenagers who will soon be gone, but one child who is age 7 , and really hate to leave this child with her for fear of endangering the child because of foolish things done by her mother (leaving the stove on, driveing intoxicated etc) Reading the comments leads me to think i should try Alanon, although I really don’t think this is any hope left for this marriage.
Hi everyone,this is a crazy time of year what with xmas parties, New Years eve celabrations coming up! crazy crazy time yet joyous also. Let us spare a moment or two for our next generation – our children, education is the best thing they can ever own, if your spouse is an A your child or children do suffer, often goes unnoticed – one of the gifts you can give your thirteen + year old this xmas is ALATEEN! If you are limited for a group or corrospondence in your area… START ONE UP YOURSELF! AWARENESS IS A MUST! you will see the difference in your child once they have aknoledged that they are not alone – they can share their emotions with other thirteen and plus year olds, a newcomer can listen and often relate to situations familiar to their own, by doing so it can take the isolation away, XMAS IS A TIME FOR GIVING – PLEASE GIVE TO THE CHILD THAT NEEDS ALATEEN, there are several links to ALATEEN just type it in and search the net. All my love to all, Patricia x
Hi all, Happy Holidays to everyone…I just wanted to give you an update, my husband spoke to his father today while he was drunk. Subsequently his father called me, to inform me that it was time to do something (as if I didn’t know, and haven’t been living with this). So now the family is planning an intervention. If anybody has any advice I would really appreciate it. This is the first time that I have ever had to do anything like this.
Thanks
Ann
Ann, I have never been involved in an intervention but am interested to find out your results. It sounds like you have a very supportive family that is willing to make a proactive move instead of sitting around with their heads in the sand while your husband drinks himself into an early grave (and possibly a divorce). God bless all the people out there that are willing to take a stand for their friends and family members! In regards to your earlier post, you mentioned that you did not want to talk to your family and friends about your situation. I am by far no expert, but I felt such a sense of comfort after confiding in my closest friends and family. It was such a burden lifted off of me and they have all been so supportive and encouraging. No more is my husband’s drinking problem my dirty little secret.
Al-Anon is not about leaving or staying with an alcoholic it is about learning to take care of oneself. I have been attending Al-Anon for several years and what I have experienced is finding peace and serenity in “my life”. I didn’t get this by just going to the meetings I work the 12-step program and read the literature. This program has helped all the relationships in my life work,spouse,children etc.
In my area I have never heard any meetings mention “refunding ones Misery”. I wouldn’t like that statement if I was new to the program. Alcoholism can have long term effects on any family member if they are living with them or not. I know I grew up in an alcoholic home…..how was I supposed to leave my parents when I was 10 years old? I have some baggage in my past that I needed to deal with the “Al-Anon 12 steps, literature and meetings have been my saving grace.
If someone wants to leave or stay with an alcoholic spouse if up to them. Al-anon will help you like yourself better through the process.
I have a wife along with 2 wonderful children together. I gave up, I tried to get her help through every means possible, knowing that if the words were comming from my mouth they would not be heard. During rock bottom, my wife began the AA program,but to find out, it was with all the bad influnced friends in which she was hanging out with, these people with in the meetings due to court orders. I had no choice but to leave, knowing and praying, that would be the only way for her to reconise the problem. As of today I have and always have been in love with her. It breaks my heart not to be there for her and the kids. Beleive me when I tell you, I tried, involving moving several times with the family to get her away from the company in which she was keeping,they followed. This has been over 3 years ago, now I find one of the persons in which she was running with to be dating each other.
What is someone to do.
I have an alcoholic wife too. I have been considering everything that was posted. I will tell you that Al-Anon for people affected by alcoholism is not about a God or any propaganda to drink any cool-aid. It is different, because it shows you – the spouse or friend of the alcoholic – how you might be the enabler, or how you have become codependent or some other crazy disorder because of the drinking.
Al-Anon is NOT about hanging around and waiting the alcoholic to get well. It is about you getting well – period.
Al-Anon is not always the answer. I like it and hate it at times. But it offers a place to unburden, it offers tools, really good tools that allows you to help yourself and your children, while you decide if you are going to hang in there to see if the alcoholic can stop, and if he/she does, you are working on not being codependent – like the author of this Blog points out and still in a sick way – have nothing to do now that the alcoholic is no longer drinking. But if he/she doesn’t – you can get well and make the decision to leave and create a support group and get a lot saner on the way to departure of the alcoholic spouse.
I am almost there (where? WHo knows. I waffle. Leaving is hard)
Best wishes to all – Joe –
PS – my blog on my “life with the alcoholic is below. It has something to do with Al-Anon in that I go and I repeat some of what I have learned. My blog grew, as in the beginning it was just a rant, and frankly I came up with the name because I was pissed after the first meeting when they said “Keep on coming back.” But now I am beginning to “get it”…. In fact good lawyers recommend attending, for the reason I point out about – YOU have to get better to make an effective decision. And as soon as you get better – you will be able to leave sooner – believe it or not
PPS – here is the blog: http://www.alanondiary.blogspot.com
i really liked reading all of stories. i have my own to add and need to know if anyone can relate. i’ve been married 16 years and separated for 1 1/2. we have two kids. my husband told me he was an alcoholic 2 years ago. he’s done rehab, aa, etc. nothing worked. hospitalized for pancreatitis twice. i really love him but can’t live with him but every time he said he would do what he could but always relapsed. anyway, he basically said he wanted to move back in or get a divorce. well he wasn’t moving in so we filed. i guess i filed. well of course, less than a month later he’s already dating someone and seeming healthy. i’m so angry and so bitter i can’t stand it. if he put half the enthusiasm into our marriage and his sobriety as he is for his new relationship we would be married. not one person says that i should consider taking him back since he has done nothing to change but it’s so sad. of course, the kids come first and i need to protect them. any advice or wisdom? words of encouragement?
Personally, I think you should count your blessings and move on. It sounds like you have made every effort possible to support him over the yearsl. You are independent and are someone your two children can be proud of and look up to. You have set a good example for them by removing yourself and them from that situation. Be thankful that your soon to be ex is becoming a better person, regardless if it is with another mate. Better to have him sober and functioning in another relationship, than to remain and continue down the toxic path he has been following all of these years. I guess one person’s trainwreck can be another person’s treasure in some cases. No reason you shouldn’t move on yourself and find happiness and someone to share your life with.
Wow. I was post #4 almost a year ago, and it’s amazing to see how many others have found this site. I hope you can find some comfort from it.
For those who wonder ‘what happened’, I’m hoping that it’s almost over. After 1 and 1/2 years of legal battles it looks like I’m finaly getting a divorce trial within weeks. I havent’ seen my alcoholic wife in almsot a year, and my kids’ and my home life has been pretty stable as a result. And a lot happier! Financially, it’s been a huge drain. And hopefully you won’t have a situation like I did, where my wife hired doctors and faked ‘severe depression’, and was voluntarily declared mentally incompetent. So financially it’s been very hard, and when it’s all over i will have spent everything i have. And considering that my kids are soon to start college, it’s hard for them too. But we’re happy and free of the acloholic abuse, and that’s priceless.
Since my post my wife has been in and out of rehab 3 more times, constantly harrassed me and my kids, had the usual up and down cycles, and continued her abusive behavior. Even though she says she’d give anything to have our family back, and promised to sober up and prove it, there’s been no change, no wake up call. Been there, done that.
If I were to do it over again I would have planned better. Get a good lawyer, establish a very clear plan, and spend a year or two getting ready. I know that sounds crazy but it’s true. Start taking assets and transferring them into a trust for your kids; no judge will argue with that. Document everything, especially anything threatening or violent. Dont’ hesitate to file charges. Try to find a leverage point so you can pressure your alcoholic spouse to go to mediation or separate. And you can even use separation as a carrot, to try to convince the alcoholic it will give them time to fix it.
I know it’s so hard to do things like that when you love someone. That’s why I took so long to face reality and made so many mistakes, and didn’t do many of those things I recommend. My situation is probably a worst-case, I don’t know. Maybe my wife is just more angry, or conniving or full of hate. But from reading all these threads and talking with so many others in the same situation, it seems like so many people have the same story, and it’s so rare that the alcoholic truly recovers for an extended period of time.
Am I better off now? Definitely! It’s been painful and emotionally draining and the saddest thing I’ve ever experienced. But I’m moving on, the kids are happy and I think I’m beginning to have hope again.
If you’re reading this then you’re probably going through the same hell we all have. But if you have the strength and courage to leave the alcoholic insantiy behind you, you’ll make it.
i need help to figure out what to do. i am finally leaving my partner after 8 years of on and off again sobriety. right now everything is joint. she is on the title to our home. we purchased our home 2.5yrs ago and all monies came from my savings and my retirement. i make 4 times what she brings home. i have offered to give her everything in this house except a few things i started off with and a valuable car that she can certainly sell if she can’t afford the insurance, gas etc. we unfortunately have no equity in our home yet. and now the market is really poor. she is refusing to leave. she is threatening to maybe pay for things or maybe not if i split the checking account. she thinks we can just exist in this home for all of time and tough luck to me. (although her alcohol words were much juicier). i can support myself and the mortgage. i just want her out. no hassles, no lawyers and fees. we have excellent credit and she is threatening to ruin everything. ADVICE…. thank you so much.
Thank you to everyone for sharing your experiences. My wife is an alcoholic, and she is currently in rehab for the second time in six months. I have been completely caught off guard by how quickly this devastating disease has taken my wife, and what she is capable of doing because of her addition. No behavior is “off limits” to the alcoholic. We have had a wonderful marriage for the the first 9 years. Shortly after the birth of our fourth child in April 2007 (we have 4 beautiful little girls), she began to drink almost daily. She was always a heavy social drinker, but never drank during the week, or hid her drinking from me. Her first stay in rehab was a disaster – she complained daily about how useless it was. When she came home, she relapsed within a week, and we have been through hell since she came home. Three weeks ago, my wife and children were going to meet me at the circus on a Saturday afternoon. Although I only left three hours before the circus started, my wife drank a bottle of vodka before getting in the car with our four children. It was the most frightening experience of my life or our children’s. I tried to get her to pull the car over for over an hour, but she refused. Finally, she had a “fender bender” on the highway, and I was able to get her location from the other party to the accident. My wife was distraught but she didn’t look drunk. I encouraged the officer on the scene to evaluate my wife after she provided the wrong birthdates for our children. My wife failed the field sobriety test, and had a blood alcohol content of 0.33. She spent 5 days in jail, and then entered rehab after her release.
Although our children saw their mother arrested, and don’t understand why she cannot stop drinking, the last three weeks have been the best three weeks in the past year. Now that that their mother is away, the children are more open about their own “hell” that they have experienced. Children need stability, attention, and love. My wife loves our children, but in her alcoholic state, she destroyed the stability of our home life, and ignored the children. Children are very resilient, but they do not deserve the instability that living with an alcoholic brings to the family. I have been granted temporary, sole custody of the children. I have no idea how I am going to work full time (I run a business with 400 employees), and raise my children, but I will figure it out. No matter what happens, it will be better than subjecting the children to an alcoholic home.
If you have chilren and an alcoholic spouse, you need to take firm action to protect your children. Never assume, as I did, that the alcoholic has certain boundaries that they will not cross – I never thought that she would get in the car with the children after she had been drinking. Children are at risk when in the home of an alcoholic.
Hopefully, this will be “rock bottom” for my wife, but she has to decide that. We are going to put our life back together and moving on. It is up to her whether she is part of it.
If you have an alcoholic spouse and you have kids or any assets at all, please read my story… post #4 and post #61. As far as the kids go, get a lawyer and get the spouse removed from the house. It takes about 3 days. As far as finances and your kids’ future goes, put as much of your assets as you can into a trust for your children. Do this BEFORE you file for divorce. See an accoutnant, tell them the situation, and they can do it so that you can still get your hands on it as needed. This accomplishes two things, it stops your alcoholic spouse from draining your accounts, and protects you. Many lawyers can’t legally tell you about this, although in private they admit it’s a good strategy. No judge is going to look badly on you for doing this, and it’s not like you’re hiding assets, you’re just protecting them and your kids. Worst case, the judge will count it as a marital asset, best case, the judge will let it stay in the kids’ name and you control it and gift it back to you as needed.
After you’ve done that, try to get your spouse to go to mediation. Remember, you’ve already trnasferred assets so now you have a bargaining position. If that fails make sure they get a good lawyer who understands the value of settling. The last thing you want is an expensive court battle. Been there, done that.
The Children Come First is absolutely right… no behavior is off limits, and there is no telling what an alcoholic will do. I wish I’d known that before my kids had to lock themselves in their room while their mother went into an alcoholic rage. Before alcohol, she was the sweetest woman you’d ever meet, well-educated, from a “good family”, non-violent… I never dreamed she’d do the things she’s done. Denial and plain ignorance are powerful. Learn. Face reality. Protect your kids. Protect yourself. And then take action.
Wow
I am so glad I found this site. When i met my husband 12 years ago he was not drinking so I only new him sober. then shortly after our son was born he started to drink on occasion, then over the years it got worse I made him leave novemeber of 2006 and he was only gone a month a racked up a huge credit card bill. well christmas time was coming and I wanted him home for the kds and he told me he would stop drinking. well that did not happen by january 2007 he was a total wreck and then out of work from a great job. he was at the lowest point i had ever seen him. After months of convincing he finally went to see someone, but he was still drinking and life was not good. I have always played both roles in the family. Tired and exahusted from working full time then going home working full time and trying to explain to the kids why daddy was passed out on the chair. but he got himself into counseling and rehab by May. it seemed to be going well, then out of rehab and on a complete spending spree. Finally he decided he wanted to be out on his own, the grass seemed to be greener on the other side. ok go for it. I, as I always do, helped him find a place. he fell in love he was going to use the gym the pool and work out and get better, well that did not happen either he was great for a month and then he wanted to come home, and he was drinking again , so that I could take care of things cause he was no good being on his own. I was the bill payer, the finaniacl guru of sorts made the dinners did the shopping, took care of everything for the kids, he well could not function on his own. so I came in to save him again. he came back home in Novemeber. I decided i was going to give him deadline. i said after the holidays we would make a decision. so christmas new years came and went and we were back at the same pkace we always were. I know in my heart I need to leave him but I look at the kids and know that they love their dad, but then i say but why do they want to see this unmotivated man as somene they look up to. who am i kidding. then i think about the house and there is no way i can live her with the kids. a lot of up keep on the property and financially. so is staying with him worth it. I know it isn’t but that keeps running through my head.
I finally went a couple of weeks ago and saw a lawyer. I felt strong when i went. I also told my husband that i went to see a lawyer. he was a bit scared and fell into worse depression. he is back seeing someone again. I mean I love hime but he needs to help himself right? I can no longer be the savior. I need to move on. But making this decision is so hard. But after reading all these posts I feel 99.9 % sure that this is what needs to be done.
I know that he will always be my childrens father and I hope he gets better for himself and the kids. But need to focus on me and the kids not him anymore. is that being selfish? I know my inlaws are upset becasue they feel like how can i leave hime at a time like this, but they just don’t understand it has been going on for so long. I am 35 ys old and I want to be happy!!!!!!
this site is great and thanks for letting me vent.
i would love to talk more to anyone in my situation or similar who at this point is just about over the fence but not quite hurdled it yet!!!!!
Please treat this post seriously as it is not embellishment – Everyone in my family is an alcoholic including both sets of grandparents one of whom committed suicide in a drunken stupor. When I say alcoholic I don’t mean a newly diagnosed alcoholic – I’m talking about people who have drank heavily on a daily for decades without any break unless hospitalization or death interfered with their love of alcohol. My Father was a world class drinker complete with all the physical and mental abuse that people here are talking about. He also died prematurely due to cancer mostly because he didn’t want to hear the doctor’s advice to stop drinking. Had he gotten medical attention early on he would be here today. But no. He preferred getting drunk to living. My grandmother died of cirhossis and her last days were marked with depression, sadness, and unrelenting pain. My Mother has been in rehab once though continues to drink despite her health conditions. She broke her hip while in a drunken state though she blames it on other circumstances. She has other serious health issues which don’t improve because her alcoholism offsets and interferes with her medication. And my brother is an alcoholic who has burned every bridge with any friend he ever had. He hasn’t worked in years (though he is capable) and blames the family for his problem (you guys made me what I am). My Uncle quit drinking years ago though even when he is sober you still have to walk on eggshells around him else he will complain about “his serenity” and how precarious it is. He has relapsed and when he does so, he will blame everyone else . And this is just the tip of the iceberg. I grew up around alcoholics and can spot one from 10 miles away. Show me a group of 100 people in a room and I’ll show you the alcoholics with %100 accuraccy. I’m not bragging (who would brag about something so pathetic ?) its just the unfortunate truth since I grew up with this crap.
I have grown so weary of how alcoholics want you to know all about their pain and sufferring yet they take no accountability for the damage and havoc they cause. Sure. they like to “work the program” and talk throw out quippy phrases like “one is too many, a hundred is not enough” as if this erases their horrible and inconsiderate behavior. Frankly I’ve heard so much “12 step” talk in my life through my relatives that I know the program better than they do. Yet they want me to be responsible for “their serenity” as if I’m part of the reason they continue to drink.
This is a big part of the reason I can’t handle the Al-Anon scene as it is a 12 Step program and I’m fed up with that lingo as my family has ruined it for me. They invoke that lingo only when they are trying to con others (like judges and parole officers) into believing that they are not drinking. I’ve dealt with this manipulation and deception for decades so I can’t possibly go to a meeting and chant the serenity prayer when I’ve heard it so misused by drunks who continue to drink.
Please note I’m not telling anyone to stay away from Al-Anon. If it works for you and your loved ones then God bless. You have my support. You really do. I just wish I could find something like Al-Anon minus the 12 step scene because that framework is ruined for me. Lastly, another reason that I avoid Al-Anon is because my brother who, as mentioned is a world class alcoholic), wants me to go so I won’t be so hard on him. Imagine that. He doesn’t want me to go for my peace and mental health – just so I won’t ride him so hard about him not helping out our Mother. He doesn’t want to stop drinking and has said so. Well there is more to say but this enough. I feel for everyone out there who is dealing with this madness. I hope we can all find the help we need.
I argue with both my father and family members when they first met my friend who is an alcholic. Now after many years together my friend still does not stop drinking and we are separting. A part of me knows that it’s best but another part of me is falling apart. I know my familty will be happy but I am scared to tell them.
Amy Post #65 – I posted #63. I was in your situation until I separated from my wife. I have temporary custody of our four children while my wife works on her recovery. I love her, and the children miss her, but things are so much better. Don’t rationalize – your alcoholic husband needs to take responsibility for his actions, and if you continue to try and “save him” you are in for a life of misery. Our children, who are 1, 5, 7, & 9 miss their mom but they understand that she is allergic to alcohol, and is having trouble stopping drinking. Run, do not walk to the nearest lawyer and do it. Your children will thank you in 10 years regardless of what happens to your AH. Don’t worry about the financial burdens, your legacy will be that you did your best to protect your children and demonstrate that no one should have to put up with the alcoholic’s behavior. If his family is upset, he should go live with them. They can deal with it. You are not abandoning him, you are helping him hit “rock bottom”.
Good luck – it really is fear of the unknown that keeps us in the relationship, but it is so much more fulfilling to break the bond and focus on your children and having a happy life.
To Centered, #62… I’m in a similar situation except we had a civil union in another state. So now, since our state began to recognize them, I have to get a divorce which I guess is good because there is a mechanism for separation. She’s an alcoholic but not close to rock bottom. Just drinks every night and keeps me up with ridiculous conversations and goes out far away and for too long. You could see a family law attorney depending on laws in your state, or maybe just a real estate attorney. I also didn’t think I needed to see a lawyer and stalled for a year or two because of that. I wish someone had just told me I needed to do it so I could have gotten this started… it’s torture. Does anyone know about documenting proof of alcoholism for someone who hasn’t been in rehab or had a DUI, but needs many stiff drinks every night to “relax”? She’s getting worse and I do not want to go back to court after this divorce decree is over. I need sole custody over our kids and currently will only get joint if I cannot prove her alcoholism.
To “Going through Hell”… it might matter what state you live in, and you should check with your lawyer. If you don’t have one go to see at least two, and compare their answers. don’t sign a retainer agreement until you’ve made up your mind. And ask details about how many similar cases they’ve handled. Read my posts if you want, 4, 61, 64. My personal experience is that the alcoholic will not be reasonable, and even if they are for a while, they quickly go back to the irrational, immature drinker. If your state is a no fault divroce state you should be in pretty good shape, but again, make sure. Some states are no fault, but if the spouse contests it you could have trouble. And if you need grounds, usually alcoholism isn’t enough. It’s the behavior that counts. Threats of physical violence or harm of any kind are usually the starting point.
As far as documenting goes, I used a $60 digital hand recorder from radio shack. Phone conversations are best, especially if you catch them on a sober morning when they’re sorry and admitting their problem. Be patient, don’t let them have any idea you’re doing this, so don’t push too far. Sooner or later you’ll get what you need. Of course, when they’re drunk at home or when coming home, hiding that little recorder somewhere can often get some good things. When my alcoholic spouse was drunk I could carry it in my hand and she wouldn’t even see it. Keep a log, noting the date, time, a brief overview of what happened. Take pictures of the alcohol you find… usually it’s hidden. Be sure to check in the toilet tank, a favorite hiding spot of alcoholics.
How old are your kids? Again, check with your lawyer but if they’re old enough to realize what’s going on, like 12 or 13 or older, there are court appointed people who will talk with them. But remember, kids aren’t “witnesses” and won’t necessarily corraborate your story, just reinforce it. Once kdis get to be around 14 the court usually lets them choose who they want to live with.
But please… see a lawyer with experience. Gather information and evidence. And above all, protect your assets so you have leverage over the alcoholic. Remember, it’s a disease, and many courts treat it just like a medical problem… “it’s not really their fault”.
Also, be careful of the alcoholic who lsoes or quits their job. You could be stuck supporting them. If they see enough docs and shrinks they can play it for all they’re worth, and get you to support them indefinitely, depending on the state you live in. Good luck, and PLAN.
Been There, Done That, excellent post and excellent advice. I have actually recently checked into (for future reference)some websites that offer digital recorders that you can attach to your phone, motion cameras etc. There are some top notch sneaky devices out there. You can type in spy or suveillance or or nanny camera or security devices as a search on the internet. Another thing I would do is check credit card receipts. Never know when a liquor store is going to show up on there. On another note, speaking of toilet tanks, for my own personal knowledge, I would like to know any other well know hiding spots for booze. I will tell you some of the places I have discovered booze bottles: under the couch cushions, in coat pockets, in the outside store room, over the back of the fence, in the hidden compartment of our family car. I am sure there are more, but those are the ones that come to mind.
to ‘The Children Come First’
Thank you so much for that advice. I did go see a lawyer and put down a retianer. My husband is 6 days sober and is entering an oupatient program at a Hospital in Hartford. I am glad for him, but I am going to do the best I can to go forward with my life. I talked to him about Divorce Mediation and he has agreed to try that. He does not want the divorce because he thinks he needs me, but I need to think about our 2 children. I pray that he gets better and can live a happy sober life and be involved with the children. But for my own sanity this is what needs to be done. I do worry about finances and how I will survive, I really do not want to uproot my children so I am going to do whatever it takes to keep the house to retain some normalcy in their life. I think it will be too devistating to take that away too.
I can’t thank you enough for the advice which helped me make this decision
Good luck to you on your journey!!!
Amy
I was with my husband for 9 years. I left my husband after an attempted suicide in November. This was after 6 rehab stays in a year, and numerous times of ‘this is the last time’. We have a 2 year old daughter. The last 5 months have been unbelievably hard. After procrastinating on filing the paperwork, I’m at the point of wanting to do it as quickly as possible. He has said that he would agree with whatever I want, but on different days he’ll tell me that he wants joint physical custody. I’ve already paid for a service online (since he had told me he’d sign whatever I put). I’m thinking about submitting that and see if he’ll sign it. I’m trying to find out if there’s any advice on this. I’m thinking if he doesn’t sign- THEN get a lawyer… I don’t want to do the wrong thing. I’m also trying to figure out what others have done with visitation. How do you protect your children from not being in the car with the alcoholic? He’s living with his parents so I don’t worry about my daughter while she’s visiting- it’s just going to the house and coming home that concerns me. Any advice would be appreciated.
What to do….
Hi I am Amy. I am going through a similar situation. I have filed for divorce and he his still living at the house, but i would suggest Divorce mediation. If it seems to you that he is willing to negotiate things then I think that is your best bet. We go for our first appt this month. I also put down a retainer on a lawyer too, just to have some legal advice. But mediation is good for compromise. I have done a lot of research on in it. Our mediator is a divorce mediator and it is supposed to make things more amicable and less arguing. Lets’ hope so. As far as having the chidren in the car with him. I asked that of my lawyer and her advice to me was that I would need to bring them and pick them up. There is no other way. I know it seems unfair that you would have to do all the commuting , but it is for the safety and well being of your children.
Hope this helps good luck
Amy
Amy, thank you for the advice! I think you’re right- there’s no other way around it, but nothing new about it being unfair. That’s the way our entire relationship has been- extremely unfair! My other idea is to have one of his parents pick her up and drop her off, that way I won’t need to do it all the time. Another question I have is regarding supervised visits- has anyone done this? What are others doing about visitation?? I want him to be a part of my daughters life but I also want to protect her and know that she’s being taken care of while she’s with him.
Thank you again Amy, I really appreciate your help.
Hi Amy,
I’m post #59 and your post/your life reads like mine. I finally left my husband and the divorce is final in August. It’s so scary and every time he seems sober I want him back for the girls. But he’s up and down and whenever he’s down I get dragged right back down again. It’s something I’ll never understand. Our mediator has been really good but I do pay for an attorney on the side to go over the documents. I have sole custody with sole discretion over his visitation. Basically means if I’m at all uncomfortable he has to submit to a breathalizer or no visit. It’s tough to be the police and really tough to be a single parent but I need to do it for the kids. The whole situation has been totally crazy making but reading your post and the others makes me at least feel like I’m not alone.
Thanks!
Jessica
Hi Jessica
I am so glad there are other people like me out there. You feel all alone sometimes. My friends and family are there to support me, but they do not know what it is like. I feel like they are done listening and are tired of hearing me go up and down. I have not found anything in my area for support groups and the one al anon meeting i went to did not work for me. My husband is 3 weeks sober and is in an outpatient tratment right now and goes to aa meetings, but he is still not right, no energy always tired no motivation. he is on sick leave from work and does not want to go back to that job. he has been there for 11 years and said he is done working 2nd shift. so where does that leave me and the kids? But then I am concerned for him and feel like I have to do something. It’s like every other minute i think am I doing the right thing? Then there are some days i can’t function and everysong i hear on the radio brings up a memory of us sometime in our life or the kids and then i breakdown. i have been seeing a therapist for a while now to help me get on track. when does the pain go away. Then I think about what are we going to say to the kids. Last yr he was in rehab for 3 weeks and we told them that daddy gets to sick when he has alcohol and he can’t drink so he needs to go awya to get better. My 10 yr old understood but my 6 yr old did not really understand. But How do we tell them that we are divorcing and they see that daddy is not drinking now, but they don’t know that he could start up again just like he has done several times in the past.
Thanks for letting me vent
Amy
Amy,
I totally feel your pain. My divorce papers were final today. that was sad. And he’s told me he’s seeing someone now. (another someone) I’m not sure when the pain goes away. it hasn’t for me yet. there are times he’s drinking and times he’s not and it’s just so hard. i really hate the roller coaster which is why i guess i’m getting divorced. i’m really sad to be alone but i don’t want that life i had before and there are no guarantees even if he stops drinking that he will continue to stay sober. i know there are no guarantees anyway but i guess i choose not to live like that anymore. tough on the kids to always tell them that their dad is sick. i know that i’m a little worried how this will play out for them later on. i think you just need to try and keep your relationship as friendly as possible and know you made a good decision. your house is sane, your life is sane even if it’s sad, scary and lonely. at least that’s how i’m getting through. and what i’ve noticed is that if i wait long enough (uncomfortably) through the bad stuff something good usually happens.
take care and i’ll keep looking for your posts.
jessica
I attended Alanon years ago when I was married to my first husband, who I had 4 children wth and loved, but he became very violent and I finally divorced him to protect myself and children. Anyway, almost 5 yrs. ago at age 55, I remarried a man 62 yrs. old who I didn’t know very well but seemed so very nice-former teacher and coach-how could I go wrong? Unfortunately, within a few months of our marriage, he quit his job-to retire-and the drinking increased from a drink or two to 4-5. Also, he began telling my family to leave us alone-even my grandkids (I did not know this at first), and eventually my children did not want to come over unless it was a holiday. Anway, it progressed until this past Dec. and he ended up in detox and had terrible DT’s-was in the hospital and nursing home. Since he came to the marriage with no assets-I ownded the house, paid the bills, etc., I felt I had waited long enough to divorce him and proceeded to do just that-and it went very fast. He signed everything w/o barely a word. Was I too hasty? Now he has quit drinking and is going to AA. He is 6 now and I am 60. Even tho I was divorcing him, I stuck by him because his son and daughter (they had good reason) would not get involved at all. i was told that he had a drinking problem for years and had quit before but always went back almost right away. It’s been 4 months now, and I am very tempted to remarry him (I see him almost every day), but I am afraid of a relapse, and my family still harbors such resentment for the way he treated them and me, and do not trust him. My problem is I am feeling very guilty-I am a Christian woman and even tho I was so distraught and angry, etc. while he was drinking during our marriage, now that he is totally sober, I see a different man. My coworkers don’t even know we’re divorced. I made up a story at church and work that he “fell”, etc. Then he did have hip surgery, so that was true. I just want to cry (and do) when i think about it. So depressing to have a failed marriage at my age. But can’t just ignore my grown children and grandkids. I was able to divorce and keep my home, and my little pension, so am afraid to risk losing all that again to someone who might just drink himself into life-long nursing care (that almost happened in December) I don’t want to have to embarrass him and tell people why we got divorced. The people I know would not have encountered him in the bar he went to, and he pretty much drank at home all day while I was at work.
There just is so much pain associated with alcoholism. I know it’s painful for the alcoholic, too. I just hate disappointing the people around me who were so supportive when we got married (all my friends-he had none-I found out why later-he had just come out of another bad marriage when I met him, and moved to my little town)
Bottom line about Alanon–it’s fine to learn to take care of yourself, etc., but I know from first-hand experience, that no matter what—the alcoholic STILl AFFECTS everything in your life-even when you don’t have children together. No matter how upbeat you feel yourself, you cannot make your family feel that way and ignore abusive behavior. So i am not attending alanon again. But I think it is a great group of people, but not for me-not anymore. I do have a very strong faith in God, but he tried to steal that from me, too. Screamed at me all night long. Anyway, sorry to go on and on. I guess I will give it more time and see if he stays sober and stays the nice person I see now.
Patricia, Amy, Jessica, and others: I feel your pain and concern. I know how hard it is. But you, your kids, your family will be better off without the alcoholic. It’s that simple, and that hard. It does get better. I met a wonderful person about a year after I resolved to leave my alcoholic wife. My kids love her, and my life is so much better.
From a legal standpoint, yes, if you can get them to a mediator you’ll be better off. As I’ve said before, my situation is somewhat extreme, in that I live in NY (the worst divorce laws in the Union), and my spouse used alcoholism to play legal games and declare that she can’t work. I spent 1.5 years and didn’t get a divorce, we’re still married and we live by getting restraining orders. It’s completely insane, and cruel. But… it can happen to anyone. I never would have believed that she’d do this to us, but she did. The point is… you MUST protect yourself and your kids. If the mediation falls apart or slows down for any reason, and you can get them to mutually consent, go to the Dominican Republic and in 3 days you’re divorced. Do NOT let the courts determine your life. Be nice, tell the alcoholic you’ll stand by them and hopefully work things out later on, the divorce doesn’t mean you can’t get remarried when they’ve “recovered”… say whatever you have to to get your divorce.
It’s one thing if someone is an alcoholic, recognizes it, gets treatment, and is sober. But for most alcoholics with repetetive problems, it’s not going to get better. It’s an endless roller coaster, and you need to get off. The person you knew does not exist anymore. Or maybe it was just an illusion of what you wanted them to be. It doesn’t matter.
I went through all the same things, the denial, the “but I love her” syndrome, the “the kids need their mother” excuses, the “I’ll never find anyone” self-pity, the “but I promised ‘until death do us part”. Those are just the phases of you coming out of denial. Life is better without the alcoholic. Period.
Why stay with someone like that, someone who can turn at any minute, someone you can never fully trust ever again? There are 6 billion people on the planet, and the vast majority are NOT alcoholics. Why waste your life in an unhealthy relationship where you can never truly love/trust them?
You WILL get through this. Get out, move on, and live. You deserve better than this.
Best of luck!
Thanks to all who have posted.
I haven’t been to this blog for a while–it helps to read other peoples’ experiences but also discouraging to see the ongoing havoc and life disasters caused by the alcoholics (or should we say ‘those with the disease of alcoholism’)–it is all so confusing how to deal with my AW–when she is sober I plan for the future–she can’t stay sober for more than a few days or maybe weeks before getting to the point of near death with blood alcohol levels at 300 or 400+ and needing emergency hospitalization under a court order because “let me go home so I can drink”.
She is now in a program focusing on restoring her spirit and is religious based–I am not optomistic and feel guilty for being a ‘realist’but she raises hope in our family and crashes it over and over.
I had Exclusive Possesion of our home and had her legally out but let her back with a Sobriety Contract–it lasted less than a day and was in no way enforcabler since I had the boysd move to another city with my in-laws to keep them from the craziness.
I know I need to move forward with the divorce/separation–papers are filed. It is hard–It is embarrassing to do when I take my wedding vows to heart and I swore I would not divorce her–I have to to protect me and my children–I am so upset, emotional and resentful that she created this mess–I know it is a disease but why doesn’t it feel like one–I have some major life moves to make in the next weeks–I hope I have the courage to complete them and I hope my AW doesn’t road block what is best for our children.
I do attend Al Anon–it helps to be in a understaning group and talk. A cousellor is also helping to sort out all the background noise and help create a plan to move forward.
Doug–USA
Comment from Doug…
I can relate to you…I’ve been vacilating between “treading water” until my kids are through with high school (4yrs to go) and “pulling the plug” once and for all, but am not sure what’s best for them, me or AW. Every time a stress factor (unemployment,her dissertation, etc.) is put to rest – a new one suddenly arises to continue the drama.
I can’t say Al Anon has help me much – I can’t understand learning to live with this problem forever – why not move on? If she were sober long enough to work through a divorce – I think I’d jump at the chance…but right now she’s so erratic that it frightens me to think what a divorce process will be like (she’s already consulted with our local shark).
Art – MI
I can’t believe what I’m reading. I”ve been married for 20 years to someone who I know now is an Alcoholic. I knew he drank alot when I married him, and I told him that once he had more than two drinks he turned into someone completely different. Absolutely no physical abuse or swearing or anything like that but he just becomes stupid and slurring and eventually passes out. No one including his closest friends know he does this – he has never missed work, can go for a whole summer without drinking and then start again – usually a glass or two of wine or beer before dinner, with dinner and then more after that – I don’t know…..
We have two kids 16 and 17 who have totally lost respect for him. He basically doesn not treat them very nice, but sometimes he can be fantastic. The two worst things are that I work with him in our own business which involves lots of shareholders and also that my parents love him totally. On my side of the family I lost both my teenage brothers, so I am the only child and once I married him and had kids, it has been a world of difference to my parents. They love spending time with him, especially my dad. Last year my spouse admitted to me he was an alcoholic. Yesterday I asked him not to drink for a month or to at least only have two while I was travelling on business, and he said he would not promise that. The thing is, I am absolutely sick and tired and can hardly stand looking at him anymore. I can’t believe how all of you said the same thing – when they are sober, they are great. I thought of divorce once when the kids were small. I realize now, both kids have indicated how totally and utterly miserable they are with him around. I should have divorced him years and years ago and I think it would be have alot better for the kids. We get along great during the day working. I don’t know what to do. I’ve been through alot of bad things in my life, got through it and am now doing really well running several business but my personal life is a wreck. Our 16 old teenager daughter wants to move out with her boyfriend since my spouse is either drunk/negative. And yet, when he isn’t drunk and negative he is wonderful. I have three University Degrees, make a huge amount of money, have been through the worst in life and yet I am stumped at what to do – do I announce to all our work colleagues and friends that he is a heavy drinker/alcoholic. He is making plans about what to do with some land we bought – build a house and I have suddenly realized that the last thing I want to do, after working so hard, is spending another 30 years stuck with him not knowing if each day would be a drinking day or sober day and that maybe, just maybe I actually have a choice. I feel like a complete and utter fool. I will give him some ultimatims I guess – it will destroy him and affect the business.
Ann,
Before you go too far, too soon, some suggestions: see a good lawyer first. Plan. Prepare. Think. Giving an alcoholic an ultimatum generally doesn’t accomplish anything, and if so, only for a short time. It could backfire and then you’re in for the fight of your life.
You can do virtually NOTHING to make the alcoholic stop. Dont’ waste your time or your emotional health. Instead, focus on what you can do to prepare for your life. At least your kids are older, and it doesn’t seem like custody will be an issue. But if you don’t plan this out you could lose everything you’ve worked for and wind up supporting him as well. Remember, the court views alcoholism as a disease… “it’s not their fault”.
If I were you, I’d go to the aaml.org site, talk to a couple of the best lawyers you can find. If you have a good lawyer friend you can get referrals. When seeing the lawyers ask about their experience in matters like this, and ask for specific case names. Research them and make sure. You want a lawyer who is not only familiar with divorce from alcoholics in your state, but also one who understands the complexities of your business situation.
Do NOT let your AH know about his. Keep your cool. Take whatever defensive and prepatory actions you can take.
The idea is to be prepared, as a defense. Alcoholics often lash out and will do as much damage as possible, since they are too immature to truly care about others or to understand the hurt they cause.
Then, when you are truly ready, financially and emotionally, suggest separation or divorce mediation. If that doesn’t work you can then give your ultimatums, operating from a position of relative strength. Be generous and make it an offer he can’t refuse.
And yes, your business will suffer, greatly. But you will be free, eventually. Above all, you want to try to avoid the courts. No one wins in that situation.
Hang in there, and remember that you and your kids deserve a better life, and you WILL achieve that. Best of luck.
I am so, so grateful for the advice, Been There, Done That. I thought if I ever said an untimatim – me/kids/house/family or booze, that it would be a no-brainer – maybe not. I will use the summer to collect my thoughts – and made some discrete inquires so I”m prepared with what I decide. The business won’t be problem, it will be the land we bought near my parents – he LOVES it out there – I had thought things would work out – he seemed to happy to be planning house, gardens, etc. then starts a drink-a-thon. If he has more than two he acts stupid. He is drunk and passed out at least
1 to 3/4 nights a week – I have kept track sometimes. Then he can be fine two weeks in a row. They are so stupid because without drinking, they are wonderful. Reading the blogs I realized they all seem to be alike. I”m just tired of having to handle this man for 20 years, and yet I love him (sober) with all my heart. Thank you so much for the help and advice.
Ann, glad to help. Of course, collect your thoughts, but also protect yourself. For example, I don’t know how far you are on building the house etc., or the laws in your state. But be sure to thoroughly protect yourself. Right now, I’m guessing it’s more about love and emotion for you, and that’s understandable. We all go through that, and our hope that they’ll stop drinking springs eternal… to a point, I guess. But for them, it’s not a no-brainer choice. And unfortunately, for some of us, the love is destroyed and it becomes more about legal battles and avoiding bankruptcy and trying to break free. Alcoholics can do an enormous amount of damage, do NOT underestimate that. Watch out for your busienss, alimony, etc. For example, what happens if he ends up in rehab over and over, can’t work? Who will support him? (you guessed it… you will).
In the meantime, try detaching completely from him, emotionally. sooner or later you’re going to ahve to do that. Don’t argue, don’t try to get him to stop, just move on with your life and completely ignore the drinking. If he’s smart and is emotionally ready, maybe he’ll start focusing inward and realize the pain he causes. Or not. Hang in there, let us know how you make out.
I’m glad I found this site.
I’ve been married to an alcoholic for almost 20 years. The only reason I’m here is because of the children, who are now 13 and 16, and are wise to his crap. I’ve always outearned him, but thought he was a decent person when I met him. Like the rest of you, my experience has been that he can be decent when sober, but can never stay sober more than a week or two at a time. Then it’s always, “Oh, I can have one or two beers,” and before you know it, he’s back to pounding back 6-8 every night, staying up til all hours, passing out, and sleeping all day. No surprise, his father was an alcoholic.
In March he had a stroke, even though he is only in his 40s. He made a good recovery but I’m deathly afraid that if/when he has another one, he’ll end up totally disabled and then I will have to support and take care of him for the rest of my life. I’d rather die.
The good thing is, this seems to be the impetus to getting out of what has been a loveless marriage for many years.
However, I don’t want to give up my home and everything I’ve worked so hard for. Going to court is like going to Vegas, and I’m not a gambler.
I’ve talked to lawyers in the past and was told that he could be entitled to half of everything. I was also told that because I outearn him, I may have to actually pay him a form of alimony, even though he is perfectly capable of working.
I like the idea of putting assets into a trust fund for the kids. Can you go that with your primary residence and/or retirement funds?
Thanks
Laura,
What state do you live in? Go to divorcesupport.com and look up the laws in your state. Check with your lawyer about the trust fund, but I can tell you what I’ve learned. I’ve had 2 out of 3 lawyers tell me to fund the kids’ college in a UTMA account (like a trust but much easier to set up). The third said only about $20,000 per child might be OK, the judge will probably say the rest was a willful attempt to avoid giving her half. But what can you lose? Worst case the judge says no, you need to pay him half of that money. Best case the judge sides with you. It’s better than sitting on the money and guaranteeing he’ll get half. Do the kids want to live with you? That will mean child support for you, which will reduce the alimony. My understanding is you can do the trust or UTMA thing for anything you have control over, even retirement funds. Again, I look at it like this: even though early withdrawl to give my kid’s will cost me a 10% penalty and taxes, it’s better than giving her half.
Your situation sounds similar to mine. I’m still fighting a legal battle, because my alcoholic wife got herself declared “allegeldly mentally incapacitated” because she’s depressed. So now she has her lawyer and a guardian (another lawyer). Even though I got my wife to agree to settle on several occassions, the lawyers won’t do it. Trust me, you don’t want this to happen.
Get everything financially set, know where all the money is. Legally reduce your income if possible. Transfer whatever you can to your name or your kids. Find ANY leverage you can over him (his job, anything he did that you know about, anything that will force him to see reason). Then very gently explain that you want to get separated, to give him time to go to rehab, get on his feet. Suggest a mediator and go. Avoid the courts at all costs. If you get him to a point where he’s agreeable, you can even go to the Dominican Republic and be divorced in a day. Do that if he’s willing, because it gets it over with quickly, it’s 100% legal, and even if he tries to battle alimony or the distirbution of assets back home afterward, at least you’re divorced. I don’t know your situation but mine was that she’d be agreeable and reasonable one day, drunk and unwilling the next. Once she went to a lawyer, my fate was sealed.
Good luck, have strength and hope.
Been gone for a while but now I am back. I had a pretty couple of rough weeks wmotinally, but today I feel strong. We have agreed to tell the kids this weekend about the divorce. I am a little nrevous, but I know I will get through this. we figures we take them to the beach for the day and out for lunch and make it as comfortable as possible.
My AH just started back to work last night after 3 months of being home on leave. Thank God, I could not stand him being home and drinking and just sitting there in the same place all the time and doing literally nothing but drinking and sleeping and maybe wash some clothes. I bite my tongue and tried to “detacth” as they say. It was so dam difficult to do that. I wanted to say you are home doing much of nothing a youlaxy bum nd you can’t do anything , like clean the house or any small projects that need to be done. i mean who gets the oppurtunity to have 3 months off and then you do nothing, but i know its the alcohol, but for a someone who is not an alcoholic we see it so different. I would have had the house painted garage straightened and so much done. so detaching my self took some work, and i am still not fully detached. It is very hard.. As my therapist said, you can’t worry about waht he is not doing . concentrate on yourself and the kids.
I have to tell you I am getter stronger each day. I now only have a melt down maybe once a week.
Good luck to all of you and keep posting
Amy CT
sad to read thru all the comments, and see so much of the same selfishness noted. i was married to a recovering alcoholic for 13 years, and when we divorced he started drinking. we have joint custody of a 15 and 12 year old, and for 4 years he has steadily gotten worse. For a long time, the kids never mentioned anything, then I started hearing things, and seeing him out, and a few months ago, i took the kids, after a long argument between my son & him. (over menial things, as usual) with the understanding that he would get treatment, before they could come back to his house. he agreed to let me have them- no legal action was taken to get custody. we live in the same small town, and so i hear about his drinking- even still. I have told him if I hear of anything, see anything, or the kids hear of any drinking escapades, i will seek full custody. He sees them a couple times a week, has asked for summer to return to every other week (original joint custody situation). He tells the kids things like he had the chance to go out, but stayed home- like he’s recovering nicely, and they believe him. I’m afraid I’m going to be the “bad guy” here, by getting custody of the kids, and ‘taking them away from dad’ after he’s been supposedly trying so hard. i have never been to al-anon, he supposedly is going to aa meetings, but he gets home late and doesn’t get to work in the mornings the next day after he attends…?? i worry that he’ll get worse if I file for full custody, and i feel like an idiot for doing nothing, and ALWAYS giving him the benefit of the doubt. ei. he was supposed to have bkfst with my daughter- HE set it up. he overslept and never showed. we went over and woke him up, so she wouldn’t be late for something he was supposed to take her to, and then he jumped all over me for jumping to conclusions. I found out later, that he was out til 3 am drinking…
don’t know what my point is- just nice to throw it out there to see if anyone has gone thru anything like this?? sober all our married years, now drinking… to take custody, or not?
HI kriss
There never seems to be an end with an alcoholic. I go to see my lawyer and I am fighting for sole legal custody of the kids. In CT you have joint custody regardless of who the parent is they they live with, so you have to fight for sole legal custody. I have much documentation about his drinking and it is not a safe environment for the kids. that is my stand on things. Our divorce won’t be final until August and he does not have a lawyer, so i feel i have the upper hand on this, but it can all turn around and bite me in the ass too. but i feel i have enough on him to get it, and i really don’t think he will fight it. I say go for it for the safety of your kids. I know they are older then mine, but why let them see their dad like that. he can call and talk to them and maybe have 1 visit at your convenience and when the time is ok with you… Stop it for the kids and your own sanity. so you may seem like the bad guy right now but in the long run they will appreciate what you did for them and yrs from now they will know what kind of dad he really was.
keep posting anf keep in touch
Amy CT
I am sober almost 6 months. She tells me she believes I will never drink again. That I am a better person than when she met me. That she “loves me but is not in love with me”. The “one day at a time” statement is something we use to get through the day when times are tough. I’ve used one hour at a time earlier in recovery. It’s not an excuse to drink one day and not the next.
Yes, it’s a disease. It runs in my family. Grandfather, Uncle, sister.
She wrote a friend early in my recovery about how much better things are at home, now, she wants a divorce and does not want to try to save the marriage. There is a 2 1/2 year old child involved. What happened between 4 months ago and now? I certainly have not had anything to drink.
I think she believes everything should have completey changed faster than it is… I am still something of a slob. I still have a tendency to isolate, I still have a tendancy to be somewhat passive aggressive – I’ll say I’ll do something, and then don’t do it.
This is why I still go to meetings, to understand my personality flaws and work on them.
Her father is a heavy drinker. I am much older than she is. So, I can see all three reasons given in the original post as contributing factors. I also think I helped to kill the relationship by being a verbally abusive/jealous active alcoholic.
I do know the best revenge is living well, that I got sober for *me*, and that I willbe here sober for my daughter.
I wanted to add one other possible reason for what the original poster asked about.. which, if anybody remembers, is why spouses leave an alcoholic who is in recovery and no longer drinking.
Straight out of the big book – the spouse has tried to get the alcoholic to quit, has been unsuccessful, then this AA/God thing does it, and there is some resentment.
The alcoholic also is caught up in heavy recovery for a while, might not pay enough attention to the home front. More resentment.
Other fun things I’ve heard –
“I love you more now than I ever have, I just don’t want to live with you or be married to you”.
“I couldn’t leave you while you were drinking, you’d have died” (probably true)
“Now I look like the bad guy for leaving you when you’re sober”.
Overheard at a meeting…. “Expectations are like pre-paid resentments”
Ok…here goes. I have known my husband for 10 years, married for 4 and I have ALWAYS know he was an alcoholic. Empty promises, tears, periods of sobriety, then back to the same cylce. I am now the proud parent of the most beautiful 16 month old girl 😉 Tonight he came home drunk. This is unusual. He normally drinks at home, because he doesn’t want anyone to see him drunk (for fear I or someone else may use it against him). Tonight we were out at our neighbor’s house and I didn’t even say goodbye. He stayed an extra hour and a half and showed up at our back door with eyes glazed, red-faced from the liquor, and smelling just terrible. I know you are not supposed to argue with an alcoholic when they are drunk, but I am angry, sad, and so scared. I put my daughter to bed and prayed that she never had to see her father this way, but I knew it was useless. I love him when he is sober, I can’t see myself leaving him, but how, God, how do I find help, strength, and hope. I do not want to put my daughter through a divorce. He is great dad during the day. He waits until she is in bed to start (no, this is not an excuse, just telling it like it is). He never misses work, never spends money on ANYTHING, is a wonderful provider (I work, too), and a good man overall. I HATE THIS! I just want to crawl into a little ball and hide with my daughter. What if I try to get the divorce and he gets custody?? What if he tries to take her from me?? What if I don’t do anything and he hurts here?? What if, what if, what if??? This stinks! He won’t go to AA, he told me he wants ME to help him…What the heck is that about !?!? He is a grown man. I know he has stress, but so do I and he is at the top of my list. I don’t mean to go on like this. I know it sounds like to same old story, but I don’t want to leave. I should, but I want to work it out and I’m sure he does, too. I just need help. He went to therapy with me…for me…once. It didn’t help (the doc told me there was nothing wrong with him!). I feel lost and any sign of hope is gone. Anything would help, please.
Lucy
Lucy – You need to ask yourself if this is the situation that you want to bring your daughter up in. You have no ability to influence an alcoholic’s behavior. He will decide when/if he wants to get help. Your primary responsibility is to your child and yourself. There are a lot on unknowns – however, when you decide that living like this is not acceptable, you’ll know the first step that you must take. After that, the next step comes into focus. I strongly encourage you to attend Alanon. It helps to meet with people going through what you are going through, or have already been to hell and back.
My wife has been in recovery for 6 months. She lives in a halfway house, and sees our 4 girls (16 months, 5, 7, & 9) on week-ends. She has been sober for 6 months, and she is working to put her life back together. Stopping drinking is the critical first step. You then have the opportunity to start working on the real issues that are so significant that they cause a person to choose death by drinking.
Good luck – this is hard, but you’ll know what to do.
Lucy, what quality of life do you and your daughter have when you just want to curl up in a ball with her? You don’t want to put her through a divorce, but do you want to put her through living with an alcoholic father? Kids grow up, they stay up later, and you won’t always be able to keep the secret from her. He went to therapy for you, not for himself. That doesn’t work. Get out while your child is young, it will be less difficult for her in the end. I seriously doubt your husband would get full custody. As you said, there are a lot of “what ifs”, but you have to live in the present and stop getting ahead of yourself.
I married an alcoholic one yr ago last April. I moved out the weekend before our first anniversary. He too is a functional alcholic, hasn’t missed work, has never gotten a DUI etc etc. He only drinks at night, after I go to bed. It’s great going to bed alone when you’re a newlywed! He would come to bed slurring his words, falling down, and vomiting all night. He came to bed Christmas night fall down drunk. We have no children together, but I have an 11 yr old from a previous marriage. The last straw was when my daughter woke up and saw the rage and anger he was exhibiting when he was drunk. He’s a mean drunk, verbally and emotionally abusive, and on a couple occasions I have feared for our safety.
I had to stop allowing him to manipulate me and I had to stop making excuses for him. There are a lot of people under a huge amount of stress, but they are able to cope without the bottle. I sincerely doubt he’s under more stress than you are, living with his behaviors and always wanting to protect your child from her own father.
The hardest decision I ever made was to leave him. I loved him, but didn’t want to live my life like that anymore or put my daughter through it. Life is too short. It still hurts, but my life is much more peaceful now. We’re going through a nasty divorce and I will most likely end up filing bankrupcy which absolutely is a horror to me; I’ve always been very responsible and have kept my credit in the 700s. As uncomfortable as that is to swallow, I realize it’s more comfortable than living with a drunk. I work full time and have always been able to support myself and daughter on a Social Worker’s salary. If you’re not able to financially make it on your own, there are many resources out there available to you.
There is a better life out there, even though you can’t see it now; I have just recently seen a glimmer of it. I started therapy for myself and daughter a couple months ago. The results of living with an alcoholic can be very destructive and leave many scars.
Don’t let him torture you anymore. Alcoholics are tortured souls, and they want everyone else they love to be just as miserable.
ALWAYS REMEMBER, LOVE CAN’T CURE ALCHOLISM. Good luck, and I wish you the best.
I am a female alcoholic. I am reading this blog, wondering whether there is anyone out there like me. The sober mates want divorce. I want a divorce to recover. I am a smart woman and believe that had I divorced years agao, I would not be in the state I am in.
I make sure that my diabetic son has insulin, that homework is done, call teachers, try to make sure bills are on time, work in a job that is professional (masters degree).
Do any of you believe that the relationship was flawed from the start? Did your spouse bow down to you as a way to avoid problems? I know I have a problem and that is has become a family problem. I want to rectify it now. I never want to remarry. But I do not want to divorce (16 years) and cause my kids the problems I see in divorce families,
I left my alcoholic husband two months ago. I finally had enough, and I just packed the car with a couple suitcases and drove away. It’s been about the scariest thing I’ve ever done. Scratch that. It is the scariest thing I’ve ever done, but living that way was completely unacceptable for one more minute.
Since July 6, I’ve lived in 10 different places (friends, motel rooms, housesitting) and have finally found a little place to rent where I can have my big old lovable dog with me. We have no kids and have been married six years.
He was really belligerent when I first left, calling and yelling, drunk. But then I calmly told him I wasn’t going to listen to that anymore, and I’d put the phone down on the receiver if he continued. He stopped. He started shifting. He went to counseling. He’s going to AA. He’s dealing with the bills (I did all that before). He got a job (hasn’t had a full-time job since we’ve been married, though I’ve held down 40-plus hour a week professional positions). He says he hasn’t drank since Aug. 22. I’m not sure I believe him, but I hope for his sake it’s true. It’s hard to know. He’s been to three rehabs (one as recent as last summer) and always relapsed.
My 75-year-old mother says she’ll disown me if I ever go back to him. That’s difficult to hear even though I understand what she must be feeling. He wants me back, and part of me wants to be with the healthy, vibrant, funny, loving him. He’s an alcoholic; he knows all the manipulative things to say, but we are also deep friends and we do love each other. He understands why I’m gone.
I’m not sure what to do. I know I don’t want to go back now for sure. I feel like I’m going to need at least a year if not more to live away from him. Do I go ahead and ask for a separation? I brought in money and assets to the marriage, and now I have nothing. I’m starting from scratch. He had a lot more assets than I did, but he drank them away, and he’s also generous to a fault so the money just went. Any advice or “atta-girl”s are appreciated. This is hard, but I’m doing it. What do I tell him about our future? I’m not sure myself. Part of me just wants to cut bait; the other doesn’t. I absolutely do not want to be around him, the drunk. That’s over. Not interested. But I’m scared he’ll go back. What’s going to keep him consistent? I have to have that and I know I have no control. And yes, I’ve been to Al-Anon (detaching, for me, is no way to live; if I wanted to be a robot I’d become a Stepford Wife).